3AM Laying in the dark.Me:
"I feel like the parent of a teenager on crack. No matter how much we love her, we may not be able to change her and make her right."
Mimi:
"Yeah"
This is after Mimi wakes up because Tita is biting her nose - hard. She then holds her down, as we've been told to do, and I wake up because Tita is screaming so loud that I'm sure every turtle in Half Moon Bay that was on their way in to lay their eggs immediately turned around and swam away fast. She also never stopped fighting and trying to bite and scratch Mimi. Finally, she let her go and she ran off the bed.
A few minutes later while we are both laying there in the dark contemplating this evil spawn of satan that we have raised and love dearly, she jumps up on the bed and clamps down on my big toe. I repeat the drill, she screams and fights and eventually when she lays still for one half of a second, I let her go.
Next, she attacked Mimi's face again. This time Mimi trapped her under the sheet and held her there until she calmed down and let her pet her and then fell asleep.
Did I mention that we go through this every night?
While we were in Merida last week we took her for her second set of shots. She was as awful as she was the first time. The vet told us that we have to establish dominance and that we should hold her down until she poops and pees! WTF? No! That is more than I want to deal with, especially since these events generally happen in my bed in the middle of the night. But, we are trying, we just aren't going for the wet rewards.
Most of the time she is wonderful, she plays and purrs and falls asleep on your shoulder. I can't tell you how much we love her and just adore her. It's the dark side that is not working very well. Because we love her we want her to be socialized and know how to behave when people want to pet her or pick her up. I don't want to have to warn everyone not to touch her or have to lock her up somewhere whenever we have guests. Frankly, I'm not all that thrilled with the constant scratches and bites I have on both arms and feet. I know that we will do everything in our power but I don't know that it will work. I'm starting to worry that there is something not quite right with her. It makes me want to cry. I can't imagine how horrible it would feel if she were a human child.
posted by Jonna at 2:58 AM
18 Comments:
Oh ladies, I'm sorry you have a demon kitty like Changa! Establishing dominance is good, though difficult. Spray bottles of water helped when Changa was that age, she HATED getting that water shot. There is a chance that when you get her fixed she could calm down a bit.
Or maybe you just need to put some Valium in her carne.
Seriously though, be very careful with the bites, they can easily become infected, little kitties have some good bacteria on their teeth and on a puncture wound it can enter your blood stream. Is there anywhere you can stash her at night time, her personal sanctuary (and your personal protection)? Maybe a little bathroom bedding, litter and water and shut the door so she doesn't go all Freddy Kruger on you in your sleep.
Good luck lovey mamas!
I agree with CC, she should have her bathroom with her litter box and a nice bed when it's your time to rest.
Our son does that with his cats even now they are adults because they roam the house and make noise. They go willingly, it is their place.
It really does sound like you have not established dominance, maybe a little too much affection up to date. Have you ever watched the Dog Whisperer tv show? Your calm, assertive energy WITHOUT frustration or anger is how to establish dominance. I have a feeling it's similar for cats.
Hang in there.
some cats are just cats.... not domestic cats. it's natures way of making sure that not all cats are domesticated. that's what i think anyway.
little tita has quite a catanality..i've had cats that were meant for outside... is she allowed out?
wishing the best with her.... my mother prolly felt what you two are feeling, about me when i was a young thing... and what i felt most recently, until the youngest was out of the house.... oy.
I third the bathroom suggestion. My kitties stayed in the bathroom at night for quite some time and they were used to it. Their food, litter, some toys, their beds, they really didn't know any better. Now that they are a bit older they stay out in gen pop at night, and find other things to attack. And sometimes they sleep, too. Good luck, your kit is just so CUTE. But I know what it's like to feel like you are living with a maniac (or two).
Oh, no....you mean all that cuteness has a dark side? Training is hard and tedious work but it really pays off in the end. I've never been a believer in crate training, but our recent adopted Beagle came that way....and it's kinda nice at night to have more room on the bed :) So I like the bathroom "Tita's own space" idea....but I would imagine that you'll get a lot of screaming in protest. So try that after the 22nd when we depart...so we don't hear it halfway down the bay :)
Good luck and see ya soon!
Cheryl
Well that is crappy.
I think the bathroom idea is a good one, at least you won't be laying there awake waiting to be attacked. I used the water squirt bottle on one of my cats once for training and it worked pretty good. They don't like it and it sure discouraged the behavior being displayed.
You only have one kitty? If so, I'm afraid that isolating her will make her worse. I wouldn't do it, not yet anyway.
My first thought when I read your post was that she needs another cat for company and/or that she may not be getting enough attention during the daytime.
Maybe there's too much dog-ness during the day?
Try the spray bottle suggestion, that ought to help.
My mom has a cat that bats at her ankles as she walks by. When I spent a week at her house, petting him 10 times a day, he completely stopped that behavior. When I left and she went back to petting him less often he started up again. He just needs more attention from her is all.
Also keep in mind that Tita is young. When she's older she will calm down. And when she's spayed she will calm as well. Be patient with her and give her some non-dog time during the day, that's my advice.
I agree with Rivergirl to an extent. Simon will attack my toes or ankles if I have not given him the attention he thinks he so righteously deserves. A couple times a day of carrying him around and treating him like a big baby and he is fine. Cats are not dogs, but when we raised dogs, each one was crate trained to have "their" space to go to. And they gladly slept in them at night. I would for sure try the night time isolation with your kitty. Sooner rather than later. The water bottle only works if you carry it with you 24/7 in a holster or something!
I think everyone is giving good advice. My only comment is that probably since she was separated from her mom so young she didn't get the "be nice" training her mom would have given her. Next time you are here I'll tell you the saga of Bubba the Billy Goat (His real name was something like Cinnamon of Spice Hill). He was totally bottlefed from birth and had no respect for humans at all.
I remember when I had horses I was told that it take 30 days to teach a new behavior and just once to unlearn it, so it might take awhile, but hang in there.
regards,
Theresa
Odd, no attacks last night. Perhaps she reads the blog secretly? or, our real effort at holding her down every time is starting to pay off.
She has gotten better during the day in the last week or so, she now lets us pet her a lot more before she just has to jump away or bite. It's the middle of the night thing that was or is just too much.
RiverGirl, you may be right but she's not getting a little playmate anytime soon. It had occurred to me that if she had litter mates they would take a lot of this play fighting out on each other. We are still living in our RV part of the time and it's getting very crowded, so no more cats now.
We do give her an enormous amount of attention. Maybe too much, maybe Theresa is on to it because she was only 2 weeks old when we got her and she has had almost constant attention since then. We were so afraid she would not make it and then she is so cute that we are always playing with her and adoring her. We haven't socialized her in the ways a mother cat would. So, when she bites during the day we started yelling and grabbing her. That seems to have worked but it's a lot harder to do when you're asleep.
The water gun we bought just for her is working on the plants and other stuff we don't want her to mess with. It's not great for sleeping either, too long to get it and you know I'm not wanting a wet bed! I really don't want to lock her away though. We do lock her in her kennel when we leave the RV because I don't trust the dogs alone with her.
We aren't going to give up on her. I do hope that she is a rebellious teenager and will calm down. I like the "catanality" Rachel, she has that and she is fearless. I worry about her lack of fear, sometimes I think it would be a good survival tool.
Sometimes though (when I haven't had enough sleep) I start worrying that she is not going to get better or that she has some damage of some sort. Thanks for all the good suggestions, it makes it feel more normal and not like some evil spawn that only appears at night.
Instead of squirt gun you might find a mister works better. You can mist her face but it won't be enough water to make the bed wet. My daughter keeps a mister by the bed when she's here, just to help her cool off at night anyway.
I hope you don't need to isolate her. It seems that she wants some kind of attention, and isolation would give her less attention not more. On the other hand it's not like you are neglecting her...I'm sure Teresa is right, this is momma-abandonment stuff.
I don't train my animals, it's not me. I adapt to them and they adapt to me. So when it comes to behavior modification I may not be the person to listen to. But I do hope you don't have to leave the poor thing alone all night, that seems really sad for her.
Good luck!
I agree RiverGirl, we don't want to isolate her. We're one big old pack around here with the dogs and the kitten. Recently we had to buy the dogs new beds for the floor next to ours because it was just too hot with everyone sleeping up there, plus there wasn't enough room! So, everyone crowds into the bedroom at night! In the RV of course we are all in one small room but Mimi and I (and the kitten usually) sleep in the overhead while the dogs are below on the couch. I doubt that will change when we get into the big house, it's just the way we are.
For the dogs and the kitten, I aim for enough training to make them feel a sense of accomplishment and to give them the tools to fit well into human society. They are not in the wild, and their best chance for an enjoyable life is to learn how to fit in this human pack and be socialized. They get more acceptance and approval that way and life is easier for us too. So, we try for dogs that don't jump up on people, that know the commands that can save their lives if followed quickly in this human world of cars and streets. For the kitteh, she has to learn how to play with humans in an acceptable way or she will lose out on a lot of the love and interaction she could have. She is also learning to ride in a car and walk on a leash so she can join us in more places - like outside at the RV park - and she is learning to come for a whistle and her name. Other than that, most cats are better behaved than dogs out of the gate ;)
We just have to persevere and keep teaching her how and when to play, and curbing how rough she plays. It's a longer road than I thought it would be, probably because she had no mama and no littermates to yell at her when she was too rough. I do think she felt she was the dominant one because we have been so careful with her and so afraid she would not make it. She's healthy now, and we need to make her respect our limits. I am top kitteh, hear me roar!!
Oh how I feel for you! I had one much like Tita with a similar background. All cats are different, so none of this may help you, but here goes my observations and advice for whatever it's worth:
Cats are nocturnal animals. Tita has not had nearly enough time to adjust to your schedule. It is natural for her to be up at night, and she is bored. Things should get better as she gets older, but also when it cools down enough for you to sleep with the door open and she can explore the house and not just your bed. After all, what is there to discover in bed other than you.
During the day when she gets over excited when playing and crosses your boundaries, grasp the nape of her neck and VERY GENTLY push her down toward the ground. That is what her mom would have done. If she continues the behavior, get up and walk away. Let her know that when she crosses a boundary, play time is over.
If you have been using your hands to play with her, stop. Make sure all play is done with a toy of some sort. Otherwise you are just teaching her that your hands are something to play with, and scratching and biting are part of cat play.
Also, when your hands do get bitten, don't jerk them away. The quick movement is a play signal for cats, and she'll probably grab your hand with even more gusto. Try to slowly and gently disengage. (This will also hopefully minimize your injuries.)
If she scratches or bites while you are petting her, she may be overstimulated. Watch for a flattening of the ears or a narrowing of eyes. This is a signal that she has had enough.
You are both such good pet mommies, and you love Tita so much, I know you will figure it out. Hang in there.
Jonna - I think what you are calling training is what I'm calling adjusting, it sounds about the same.
You'll get there. Tita is lucky to have you.
Roberto and I had a MEAN cat (it actually pooped on my purse once but that's a whole different story) when the cat would freak out like that Roberto would give it a bath- dunk it in a bucket of cold water. It worked like a charm. I've done it to my cats when they fight and it calms them right down and they start loving and licking each other dry.
My girlfriend has a cat that started dominating her house to the point that she was actually scared of it- she ended up bringing to a kennel for a night just so she could get a full nights sleep- the kennel workers bathed the cat and cut it's nails- after that the cat calmed down. The vet explained to her that cats get more aggressive when their nails are longer cuz they feel like 'check me out I'm the shit with these big ass machetes'.
Good luck!
I got goosebumps about the whole what would we do if it were a human child- I know a woman that adopted a Romanian child and figured out later he had attachment disorder. I won't describe the horrors that went on in their house- lets just pray that Tita doesn't try to set you on fire while you sleep!!
I know this is a very serious issue, but do the dogs seem just a bit smug these days?
We had our new kittens declawed, not a popular action I know, but we find it works best for us because we do wrestle with our kitties and claws are too much for that play fun. These cats still bring us dead birds, lizards and an occasional hummingbird or butterfly. We still watch them climb the avocado tree and even the palms, Bartholmeow can get up almost 25 feet before he realizes and panics and runs backdown. The declawing doesn't seem to limit them in anyway, even the defense of their property from the odd feral cat roaming thru, although your dogs would take care of that.
I have had two cats that needed to know who was boss. One I put in a large cloth purse that had a zipper that when you put the zipper tag down it locked itself on the zipper and couldn't be pushed open, I left just enough for the cats head to stick out. I walked around for an entire day with the purse slung over my shoulder and her head sticking out. We talked all day, well after she settled down, and I didn't have to repeat the experience and she changed into a more cuddly cat.
Very cool cave, I'd have been terrified it would crush Mimi. And a shame about the sour orange tree and very good of you to let it go. I'd have stewed about it for days.
Anita
Hi Ladies;
Seems like the problems are getting better, but in case this helps - we have two cats, and when they were teenagers, we went through a lot of the same stuff. It was awful - every blind in the house was torn up, stuff was broken, everything got clawed, no one's feet were safe... As they got older, they calmed down, but before that, we finally learned to put them in the bathroom for the night to get any peace at all. We left them with their comfy bed, litter pan, food and water. Problem solved, house gloriously free of wreckage in the mornings, peace reigned again, evil demonspawn kitties get to stay (and to live). We still put the kitties in the bathroom every night, now a few years later, but mostly because they both just go to the bathroom and hang out in there waiting for us to fluff up their bed and put out fresh water. Life really is so much more peaceful now, and no young cats had to be killed mercilessly for their transgressions. >;}~
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